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JoyceH
Raw Newbie
I live in Vermont, probably one of the most liberal states in the Union. We have a huge local, organic food movement, we were one of the first (if not the first) states to enact Civil Unions, we go to great lengths to preserve our environment, small farms, and control urban sprawl (the famous Act 250 where it takes years to build anything). We have all kinds of earth friendly and socially minded independent parties. Vermont is a state that focuses on social issues, it’s people, the environment, alternative energy and embraces all cultures and religions. Sometimes it feels like we’re in our own little world up here as we once had more cows than people :-) ... I’m proud to say we are the ones that have Bernie Sanders, our great independent US senator who is the epitome of Vermont and it’s values. (Vermont is certainly not perfect but I feel it’s one of the most precious, undeveloped states in the union)
So what’s my point. Well we have a Republican governor!!! It’s because of independent parties running for offices. I’m not saying they don’t have a right to run for office as they certainly do!! But they normally spit up the votes, giving the Republicans the win…. At the moment we have 3 candidates running for Governor. An independent, Anthony Pollina, a democrat, Gay Symmington, and of course our incumbent Jim Douglas the Republican. Sadly we will have another Republican governor as he will gain the majority of votes. (luckily he hasn’t been too damaging to Vermont but he really hasn’t done much either….Howard Dean was great!)
So I know a lot of you are going to vote for the Green Party this November and maybe some other small parties. But don’t you think that will help the Republicans gain the majority of votes. Didn’t the republicans help finance Ralph Nadar’s campaign for this exact reason???!!! Maybe you don’t like Obama. But by voting for an independent, you are helping to keep the current regime in power….
Last election, I wasn’t a huge fan of John Kerry but I knew the country would really suffer with 4 more years of the Bush Administration…so I voted for Kerry…
Thoughts?? Meditating? I’d like to hear you’re opinion especially since I have really enjoyed reading your very thoughtful posts (and you mentioned voting for the Green Party).
Comments
i am truly ALL for the green party, but not so that the republicans can win another 4 years. the green party is the best “divide and conquer” mechanism the republican party could hope for.
we know that an independent just isn’t going to win the national election. Mccain is a scary option… and since he’s ancient, it’s more like “Palin for President” anyway.
From reading the forums….
I know some of you are die hard McCain supporters. I know some of you are die hard Obama supporters.
Neither one really cuts the bill for me.
But in the end, if I had to ask who is the lesser of two evils…I would go with Obama. I would not like to see my Freedoms stripped away! I know some McCain supporters do not understand that, but that is what would happen…to those of us that do not fit the cookie cutter cut-out of the ideal person/citizen.
I like the independent parties…my husband will be voting independent. Me…I wish I could vote my conscience vote. (like Kevlar spoke of on the Definitely Not a Palin Fan forum.)
But like many, I am worried if I do that, it would only help put McCain in office.
So, it is coming to an end and I am still “out-to-lunch” on this subject. But like I said, when it comes down to it I will probably vote Obama….because it would do more than terrify me to have McCain in office.
Off the subject, but does it concern anyone… that in the past (before the Presidential Campaign began)...during speeches the camera would shoot to McCain and he would be asleep. This disturbs me. To see a candidate who is sleeping when he should be paying attention.
I think that the Green/Intependent party may be the most likely to embrace the interconnectedness of business, environment and society, but I believe they need to get past the reputation for being a one-issue group. In general, conservatives focus on economics, liberals on social issues, and greens on the environment. They are all three inextricably linked, and until we embrace that and develop a WHOLE-istic view of things, we will remain out of balance.
Personally, I like Obama but not because of his policies. I’m more of a libertarian (anarchist, actually) than a liberal, but Obama is offering something I believe we really need right now. Instead of sending the message that he will fix all of our problems, he’s using his experience as a community organizer to inspire US to get involved and offer our best to our communities. The country will only change when it changes on the local level first. He won’t block our efforts from the top like others will. I feel grateful to have a man so solid in his own sense of himself that he can lead in a way that brings out the best in others.
I hope to see him become president for the next 8 years, during which I will be working on a doctorate that integrates the financial, social and environmental aspects of resource economics. I can, for the first time in my life, envision a future where those of us who want to build on solid, responsible and sustainable principles will be welcomed into decision-making roles, and the next generation will be taught based on these principles.
Seeing how Obama and McCain will both start more illegal wars, I cannot, in good conscience, vote for either of them.
These are the main third-party candidates:
Cynthia McKinney – Green Party
Bob Barr – Libertarian Party
Chuck Baldwin – Constitution Party
Ralph Nader – Independent
Listen to what they have to say, and vote for the candidate you most agree with. If it turns out that Obama or McCain is the one you agree with most, vote for them, but don’t vote out of fear anymore.
Thanks for the reminder Kevlar.
I appreciate your thoughts. I hear you, I am listening,
...but currently still out-to-lunch.
I actually do like Obama and agree very much with his policies/philosophies for many reasons.
I can’t imagine Obama starting any illegal wars. John McCain, on the other hand, has a very volatile, unpredictable personality from the research I’ve been doing of him. I even read he has quite a temper and thus gaining the ‘maverick’reputation which he has molded into a brand of politics used for his campaign. If elected president, it would not surprise me if McCain initiated another illegal war.
If people are disgusted and weary of the current administration, our crumbling economy, tax cuts for the wealthiest, etc…, voting for an independent is going to keep that ‘regime’ in power for another 4 years. Even if these independent candidates are the best qualified and the smartest people in the world, they are still not going to win (sadly) and voting for them is really a vote for yet more George Bush failed polices.
Here’s something from the Washington Post:
“Former senator Bob Smith, a New Hampshire Republican, expresses worries about McCain: “His temper would place this country at risk in international affairs, and the world perhaps in danger. In my mind, it should disqualify him.” “
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/ar…
JoyceH wrote -
“Even if these independent candidates are the best qualified and the smartest people in the world, they are still not going to win (sadly) and voting for them is really a vote for yet more George Bush failed policies.”
This is exactly what I am worried about and do not want to see happen!! I could not handle it if McCain wins. I would truly be terrified for what little rights we do still have remaining.
^ That mentality is what keeps them from winning.
And Obama will take away our rights, just the same as McCain. Has either of them said anything about reversing the Patriot Act, the Military Commissions Act, or HR 1955?
Listen to Obama in this video: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-366125…
He sounds exactly like Bush.
Kevlar -
Honestly, you think with the small amount of people who even know who the independent candidates are have a chance of winning?
I go out my door and the people I meet could not even name one. So, explain the chances of them winning to me. (Please keep in mind my husband agrees with you, but I just see it dividing the vote up. I mean the guy I truly wanted is no longer an option. And honestly, I think the position as already been chosen. They are just trying to let the puzzle pieces fall now…where they think they need to be. Regardless of the voting machines.)
If Obama or McCain win, America loses.
Yes, yes….and I know the relationship of Obama to Bush.
It is fascism. We know they are all one of the same. Hence, the term…republocrats.
or demublicans…
Mamamilk -
LOL!!!
I Love It!!! Thanks for lighten things up a bit. I love that we can all share perspectives and keep a sense of humor. :)
In the end, I am sure we will all do what resonates truth for all of us as individuals. And the outcome, whatever it may be, will be no accident. I have not lived that long or have the wisdom of some on GR, but I have lived long enough to know there are no accidents. There is reason behind everything…whether we see it or not.
It’s more difficult for me, after the horrors I’ve learned about in recent years, to see the reason behind things, but I hope you’re right.
I am reminded…
“A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step”
- Chinese SayingIt’s a hard decision: deciding whether you want to vote for the person that you truly would like to be the leader of the US, or voting for one of the candidates with the current popular vote that you would prefer. I can see both sides and I can see how the latter choice, although somewhat more “practical” can be painful because it feels like doing something that you don’t totally believe in. Like giving up your freedom and doing something that other people are doing just because it’s the popular choice.
JH-i feel your pain. Try living in GA!!! Oh…take me back to my New England roots, PLEEEEASE!
Kevlar
I thought you might appreciate this….
http://www.restoretherepublic.com/take-action/a…
quoting part of the article…
“This November many will vote for the who they believe to be the “Lesser of two evils” without giving thought to a 3rd party choice. We must carry on Congressman Paul’s message of liberty by sharing with others the very real possibility of breaking the cycle of the 2 party system. The fact is cited in many polls that over 40% of voters consider themselves as independents, not being able to identify with either of the 2 dominant parties. This number is larger than ever and is enough to win an election.”
I do. Thanks, simplyraw. :)
Ron Paul was recently asked to endorse McCain, but chose to endorse the third-party candidates instead:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j4eziIex_dQ