why are so many on this site afraid of fruit?
I'm pretty confused now, spent some time surfing the internet (googled "raw food candida"). Wow. You can spend a year reading and all you'll probably get is a lot of confusion. Different raw foodists are saying so different things you'll probably have to agree with Frederic Patenaude when he says he feels there is no single raw food movement, the philosophies of the different "raw gurus" are so different. Anyway, I spent some time reading Frederic Patenaudes website. A lot of what he says seems to make sense. Then again, I did live on fruits alone for 2,5 months and didn't get rid of my candida. It kept getting worse. I've tried to eat less fruits, too (not easy as I just love fruits) but I don't think it has made much of a difference. One guy said he thinks there isn't a single cure that works for everyone, maybe this whole Candida thing is a number of different issues which require different remedies. I don't even know if it's Candida I've got - there is very little visible whitish something, the visible part isn't causing any trouble, but I'm most of the time too tired and not nearly energetic enough. Then again maybe what I really need is a lot of good excercise like yoga... I've had a few fantastic, really energetic days but most of the time it's the other way around.
Kelly, what was the point with the water feast again? You think there might be something stuck in my bowels which needs to be cleaned out before I can digest fruits normally?
The Living Food movement "Guru" Dr. Ann Wigmore has said during her massive trials with wheatgrass and eating not just raw but living food that taking in wheatgrass and eating a diet of living foods has cured many peoples’ diseases. From cancers to pimples that includes Candida. What she did at her institute was have ill people eat only living foods, energy soup and taking in wheatgrass orally 3 times a day and rectally in the morning before "rising". If you would like to learn more go to www.chiDiet.com
It has lots of information about Ann Wigmore and the Living Food Lifestyle. With tons of testimonials very good reading.
hi JA. i was thinking, are you really sure you still have the candida, because detox symptoms are a lot like candida symptoms. it's just a guess, but maybe you are really really detoxing. what was your diet like before you started the all fruit diet? if you were eating SAD for awhile you may be having serious detox symptoms. detox symptoms can be anything from: rashes, acne, mood swings, irritability, brain fog, headaches, low-energy, weightloss, and the list goes on. all the different toxins coming out causes all kinds of symptoms. i myself got headaches, acne, and brain fog for a few weeks. im only 21 and i was eating all organc, vegetarian then vegan for 3 years prior to eating low-fat raw vegan so i didn't have the amount of toxins that the average american does. if i went straight from eating the standard american diet to eating raw vegan i would have expected my detox symptoms to be a lot worse.
about the water fast:
water fasts are great for healing and are the fastest way to speed up the detoxing process. when you don't eat or drink anything besides water your body's energy is freed up from digestion. your body has more energy to focus on healing and clearing out toxins. people don't realize how much energy your body uses to digest food. when you free it up it can do amazing things. you also have to have complete rest during a water fast, mind and body. if it sounds like something you want to do i would recommend reading up on it first, so you can know what to expect. herbert shelton wrote a a bunch of fasting books. the basic health library volume II is a great book and you can get it for $3 on amazon http://www.amazon.com/Basic-Health-Library-Books-Single/dp/B000I...
the best way to start a raw low-fat vegan diet is to start it off with a 2-3 water fast. then eat fruits, mono-meals of one kind of fruit for a few days and then ease into eating other fruits and greens. track the amount of calories you're eating and make sure you're not eating too many or too little calories. after the fast get into a routine of exercising everyday, even if it's just for 30 min. you cannot be healthy from diet alone. yoga, rebounding, strength training, jogging, jump roping, whatever it is, you have to move your body. also, make sure you're not eating any irritants like onions, garlic, and spicy peppers. no excitotxins like salt or spices. fresh herbs like basil, cilantro, and dill are ok. no stimulants/caffeine like coffee, tea (even herbal tea), cacao or chocolate, etc.
I love fresh fruit - i basically live on it!
This post brings up an excellent point...
For the life of me i cant understand why some people are set on avoiding fresh fruit but are willing to consume large amounts of dehydrated foods or nuts that a more diffcult to digest when fruit digests perectly!
yeah! well said!
Hi Kelly- I don't go wild with fruit for fear of dental erosion... but I do eat a lot of tomaotes and cucumbers, so maybe I eat more fruit than I think... just love my nuts and avocados too much to go 811, thought!
hi osoniye! that is a common fear!
after i started this diet i got rid of my toothpaste. i brush my teeth with water all the time, especially after citrus. i have had no tooth decay whatsoever. i used to get cavities all the time before this diet too. you know what causes bad teeth? excess acidity in the body. calcium is leeched from your bones in order to neutralize the acidity and it contributes to osteoporosis and tooth loss. eating a diet high in animal products will easily do that. fruit leaves an alkaline ash so you don't have to worry about that on an all fruit and greens diet. some people try the diet for a week and say that it's rotting their teeth, but you'd have to give the diet more time before you'd be able to attribute it to that. nothing works that fast on your teeth.
don't let that fear keep you from enjoying the rest of nature's bounty. and you don't have to give up avocados or nuts but you would have to eat less of them if you want optimum health.
apes eat a diet high in fruit and they have very healthy teeth. they don't have dentists like we do. we are biologically designed to eat fruit, we would not be designed with teeth that rot from it :)
yes Kelly, I'm sure. At first I thought it was just detox, but after a couple of months of it getting really bad, I realized that it was not going to improve unless I changed my diet. So I cut out all sugar, and the rash is now gone.
Thanks Kelly and others.
Why, I guess it could be detox, too - it just feels like it's taking way too long time. I went 90-100 % raw last July from a paleolithic diet high in fruits (probably half of my calories even back then). Some wild meat, sustainable fish, cooked roots, vegetables, a tiny amount of nuts. I've loved fruit all my life so I've been eating loads of them regardless of my diet. The worst part of my diet all my life (except when paleolithic and raw) has been chocolate - I've been a chocolate addict for as long as I can remember. I could easily eat 2 pounds of chocolate (preferably one with lots of fat and sugar) a day and I always craved it when I was feeling disturbed or uneasy. I rarely had two days in row without chocolate. I'm 27.
I believe I have Candida because whenever my mental fog gets worse, I see this whitish thing on my private parts. It never itches or anything, but by the looks of it I think it's Candida. When I drink more, eat less, take grapefruit seed extract, the whitish thing disappears but my mental fog doesn't (well, it does for a while when I drink water only). I mean, how many raw foodists have had a strong mental fog for 7 months because of detox? Obviously it has something with the surgery to do since I felt good prior to the surgery (remember I was 90-100 % raw 3,5 months before the appendicitis). Not great, fantastic etc. but just plain ordinary good. Today, I realize I was near dead when I went to the hospital, and I lost all my body fat plus a lot of muscle, too. Took me 2-3 months just to start putting on weight (muscles). And this whitish thing appeared right after the surgery while I was taking antibiotics (6 days at home + 2 at the hospital). Candida is supposedly white, gets a chance to take over your body when you're killing your bacteria with antibiotics and supposedly creates something commonly referred to as "brain fog". What's more, I feel absolute worst when I'm taking grapefruit seed extract regularly (kills Candida among other things), which supposedly means the buggers are dying and spraying toxic substances all over the place (Candida die-off). Then again, there is so much controversy about Candida even among alternative practitioners it's more or less impossible to say what Candida is and how it will behave. At least that's my impression from what I've read...
I'd love to follow the 80/10/10 since I love fruits and I, too, believe they made up most of our African ancestors' food supply (though there is a lot of evidence pointing at their fruits having been a lot less sweet). I also believe homo sapiens is able to thrive on other substances, too (it would otherwise be impossible to explain the Kitava people for instance, http://www.staffanlindeberg.com/TheKitavaStudy.html), but that is probably best discussed on some other, non 100 % raw vegan forum. Anyway, right now I feel I need to clean up my body somehow, maybe my bowels never got recolonized by healthy bacteria as supposed after the surgery and I now need to let my body clean up itself before I can eat fruits without feeling tired (I always feel very tired after eating fruit, especially heavy fruit like bananas, and I love them). I really don't like supplements and the like so I'd like to avoid probiotics. I'm giving water fast a serious try starting today and see how I feel.
lulushka8- i'm sorry to hear that, but there is no way that 2 days on any diet is sufficient to make any conclusions. i don't think that doug graham is "the raw guru" i agree with a lot of things he says in the 80/10/10 book, but when i was writing this thread i was just writing about fruit, not 80/10/10. a lot of people were asking questions about 80/10/10 so i answered. i think the book is great. i read that when i started this diet and started learning about natural hygiene. it is a very healthy diet but he didn't make it up. it is our species specific diet and it's been around since man evolved. i do recommend reading his book but i also recommend reading books from other natural hygienists.
there is no such thing as eating right for your body type. we are all from the same species, we all have the same body types. our bodies all have the same functions, naturally. i do believe that what you eat over the course of your life can change how your body functions, but naturally we all have the same body type. do you look at a mountain gorilla and say that one has this blood type, so he needs to eat something different than the other mountain gorillas. no, all mountain gorillas are designed to eat the same thing because they are from the same species. humans like to set themselves apart from all other species and think that we are somehow special but we are a species just like every other animal.
omega 3 doesn't just come from avocado or overt fats. you get plenty of omega 3 from a variety of fruits including bananas. the omega 3 to omega 6 ratio in bananas is ideal, the omega 3 to omega 6 ratio in avocados is far from ideal.
also, you can't achieve health by diet alone. you have to move your body everyday! i would say that the cacao is what's making you have less energy.
"Any kind of stimulation, regardless of how dramatic or mild, produces short-term energy, but it is always followed by fatigue. The degree of fatigue depends on the degree of stimulation: the greater the stimulation, the greater the fatigue. The healthiest things a person can do at this point are to rest and remove the elements causing the stress, such as poor diet. Yet, this is when most people turn to self-imposed adrenal stimulation to regain energy, foods like coffee and refined foods in the regular world and cacao in the healthy and/or raw world. This results in a short burst of energy, then greater fatigue, and then more stimulation to try to reenergize. The circle is complete.
Each time the circle completes itself, the severity of the condition rises, creating an incremental decline in health and an increased risk factor for serious disease. The first completion of the circle will likely result only in a slightly increased appetite. The next time around will result in cravings, likely for starchy, refined foods (often making raw foodists more tempted by cooked food). Sequential passes involve difficulty sleeping, irritability, mental fog, lack of motivation, body fat gain, lean muscle loss, visible signs of premature aging, and sickness. Each round produces a more severe symptom, on top of the previous ones, compounding the effect. If this cycle of chronically elevated cortisol levels is allowed to continue, tissue degeneration, depression, chronic fatigue syndrome, and even diseases can develop. A healthy, sustainable whole food diet and lifestyle will be one that does not require additional stimulation through food. As a result, your body will re-establish its sensory system, functioning at a healthier, more energetic level without the cellular-damaging need for stimulation. Recalibration can be achieved by removing as much stimuli as possible for a set period. The less stimulation a person has in everyday life, the greater impact stimuli will have on the body. This is good. It means the person is living a low-stress life, and we know the benefits of that. But there's more to it. It also means that considerably less stimulation is needed to evoke a stress response from the adrenal glands. One of the body's most resourceful traits is its ability to adapt. Acclimatizing to stimulation is no exception."
i'm not trying to convince you to try a low-fat raw vegan diet of fruits and greens again, i just wanted to say that you have to give a diet a lot longer than 2 days to be able to make judgments. this is especially important on an all fruits and greens diet because many will have detox effects for the first few days, weeks or even months.
hey JA! i was thinking, you should go to 30bananasaday.com and write a post about your situation. there are people on that site that know a lot more than i do and they can probably give you way better recommendations :)
I haven't read Dr. Graham's book, and I'm high fruit, low fat. This isn't about Dr. Graham; this is about the human body and what's best for it.
Hmm, I don't consider myself "afraid of fruit." I just don't like very many sweet fruits. I try to eat a banana once a week or so, but I get no pleasure out of it and by the end I have to kind of force myself to finish it. Cherry season is starting, so I will be eating a few handfuls of cherries a week. Other than that...um...I like pineapple. I like lemonade if it's tart, not too sweet. Does that count? :)
I do like fruits that other people think of as veggies - like cucumber, tomato, and bell pepper. I do eat avocado - it grows on a tree, so it's a fruit. So are olives.
This is all interesting. I have been very stressed lately and start gagging if I try to eat nuts or grains. I can get down veggie juice, sprouts, some greens, and fruit.
Not sure where to go from here. It makes my digestion a little watery and I had just normalized to my other raw diet.
But the fat was making me tired.
I totally believe that fruit is the best food for humans. However I've seen several people following a fruit only diet that have problems with their teeth (see multiple threads in this site). On the other hand, fruit is seasonal in most parts of the world, which makes me wonder.
My personal experience is that eating only fruit makes me hungry all the time, maybe because it is easy to digest. At his point, listening to different opinions is good but I think each of us has to find our own path and follow our own mental and physical evolution.
I don't get it. It's almost like people who eat 80-10-10 have an ethical objection to fat. it's almost like they want to save the world with people only eating fruit. even if fruit is not the best thing for someone. why do you care? it's not hurting anyone! let people eat whatever raw vegan diet they want!
i am working towards a low glycemic diet because i have candida and other health issues. the more i am on low glycemic, the more i feel balanced. i've been drinking lots of green juice and eating salads and i DO eat fruit, just low glycemic like grapefruit and berries instead of bananas and mangoes. i say working towards because sugar is a very powerful addiction so it is taking me some time to work myself off them.
We truly aren't identical and even if our bodies were originally identical there are so many things that change throughout our lives....for example, endometriosis changed everything for me and because of it I found raw food. I'm grateful for my condition but it gives me a whole new set of physical things to deal with. This means that even our own bodies change over time and we have to adjust our diets for that too.
just trying to help. not trying to argue with anyone. i was just compelled to share because i had such great results with this diet as others do. i don't like to keep positive information all to myself :)
best of luck to everyone! much love to the fruit eaters!
Yeah, I too felt a lot of strong negative emotions on the 30b site. And no one there has yet answered my question as to how I could develop bad Candida while living on fruits only for 2,5 months. Personally, I try to think rationally and look at the results available - who is really healthy, glowing and happy and how come they achieved that. Storm Talifero is a strong source of inspiration to me, obviously because he's 60, been 100 % raw for 35+ years yet very youthful and healthy. The Boutenko family is another source of inspiration. I also feel very uncomfortable with "buy me!" websites and gurus, regardless of how successful they seem to be. I'm allergic to commercialism...
The information on the internet is so confusing when it comes to Candida. IF that is what I have. Right now, the only "sure" way to get rid of Candida would seem the one I am least drawn to - no sweet fruits, no fat = greens + non-sweet fruits. Urghh... I want to enjoy what I eat. So I'm gravitating towards the one thing I know I need to do something about - excercise! I'll probably have a go at yoga and maybe some form of martial arts, too.
By the way, I did a 48-hour water fast (24 hours with water only, 24 hours with water + a bit of fresh squeezed lemon juice because I was so tired, a total of 2 lemons used). I was really really tired yet couldn't rest as much as I felt I would have needed, had to take care of the kids and do some chores like cleaning etc. After 48 hours I was so weak I just had to get some energy so I made a green smoothie. I was planning to do a "green smoothie fast" after the water fast but we received our weekly organic fruit & veggies delivery yesterday with some of the best apples I've ever had, couldn't help - I must've eaten around 10 of them. But from today on, I'm planning to stick to green smoothies and water only and see how I feel. Keep on with it as long as it feels good. I felt bloated last night when going to bed with all those apples yet not much excercise. I didn't feel very special after the water fast - very tired when I was on it, kind of empty after it. I had no bowel movements until after the fast. I'll see how I'll feel with green smoothies and more excercise :)
JA- "I'm allergic to commercialism"...............best line I've heard in a while. hehe
I feel horrible on a high fruit diet, but wonderful on a high greens diet. I do incorporate the less sweet fruits ie; tomatoes, cucumbers, lemons and berries. My friend is the exact opposite. He thrives on a high sweet fruit diet. After spending 20 years in allopathic and naturopathic medicine I've found that everybody and every body is different. Although, the basic physiology is the same, we all have different maladies, and body tendencies ( related to the different foods, emotions, enviornments and genetics ). What works for one may not work for another. As with everything, there are many paths to wellness. It's up to us to find out which one works best for us. Of course, as we cleanse our bodies and emotions our chemistry changes and our dietary requirements may also change . The 8/1/1 may be extreme for some at this time , but may be perfect a few years down the road and visa versa. Here's to finding your own perfect path..... Much Love :)
Had to bring this over here. Let food AND LAUGHTER be thy medicine. New gonerawers, Durian Rider is a great guy but I think his time has come. What is it again?.. Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery. heehee BEST,m
(watch yer tits)
I just wasted 7 minutes and 31 seconds of my life watching that video haha atleast he has a cool bike helmet
To J A ---- I am glad to hear someone studying our human orgins. I invite you to read a book called "After the Ice" A global human history 20,000-5,000 BC. By: Steven Mithen. This guy is an archeologist who has excavated allot of the early sites talked about in this book. They look at ancient dung to try and figure out what we ate, and uncover huge middins beside the settlements full of animal bones. We killed thousands of animals, ate some into extinction, the red dear of Europe, reindeer of Europe, the whooly mamoth and the whooly rhino. To name a few. The numbers of these butchered animals is staggering. From Africa to the middle east where we find the first villages and the "wild garden" where man first learned to harvest grain and be-friend the dog. I dont think there was much fruit along that route. I did read about figs. If we did eat lots of fruit there's no way of telling. No seeds, no peels left for us to find. No ancient man said they couldnt eat something because it wasnt part of their diets. They ate everything. They also ate allot of grain and wild cereals. That much we know for sure. They harvested it, they cooked it, they ate it. The book is a fasinating read. It follows the first human circumnavigation of the globe and mostly interestingly, what we ate along the way
I tried to cut out fruit because I thought it gave me acne and that was before my transition to raw foods. Now all I eat is fruit, vegetables nuts, nut milk. I hardly use any shampoo or soap. I use burt bees products if I do. I have a couple questions. I have bad pet allergies, do you have any advice. Also do you take a b12 supplement? what do you eat? and what is your skin care routine?
jangreen- hi! man did adapt to eating animals as they migrated away from the tropics. during this time man also lived a very short life (probably due to diet, harsh climates, predators, etc.) the frutarian goes back even further than "man the hunter gatherer"
Hi brandon- my boyfriend was really allergic to cats while he was eating sad. now that he eats all raw fruits with the addition of greens and some veggies he is comfortable around cats. it's only been a few months and he is gradually getting less and less irritated by cats.
i don't take any supplements and i wouldn't recommend any either because they are inorganic forms of minerals and vitamins. only organic forms from whole, raw, food are usable by the body. supplements just put more toxic substances in your body and make it that much harder for your body to do what it naturally does, heal itself. humans obtain ample supplies of b-12 from bacterial production in their intestines.
i had a problem with acne when i was eating raw gourmet. i blamed it on the fruit and cut it out of my diet...bad idea, my acne got worse. when i started eating all fruits and greens i went through a detox period where my skin looked worse, but after a few weeks it really started to clear up. now it's perfectly clear. i don't use any skin products or any hygiene products whatsoever; no deodorant, no face wash, no toothpaste, etc. when my hair get greasy i wash it with lemon juice and that's it.
other things besides diet help contribute to a healthy body and healthy skin. it's really important to get at least 30 min of sunshine everyday. sunbathing the naked or nearly naked body is great. exercise is also really important. eating only when hungry is also really important. i usually exercise in the morning and eat my first meal after noon. your body stores glucose from the previous day so you have plenty of energy to burn before you need to eat anything.
i'll give you a sample of what i ate in the last few days to give you an idea:
here's a tip for cheap produce: i buy everything in bulk from the local organic distributor. on average i save 35-50%. call one of the local health food markets and ask who their distributor is. set up an account and you'll save so much money.
i hope this helps!
I haven't read all the replies to this thread, but I wanted to chime in with my 2 cents about the vitamin B-12. I would highly recommend lLlushka8's suggestion about the supplements if you are vegan raw. I generally do not take supplaments/vitamins etc. Personally, I think most of them just give you more expensive pee:-) But, the vitamin B-12 is way too important to experiment with (imho) my own body since there seems to be quite a bit of research showing that B-12 deficiancies are pretty common in vegans- and many meat eaters as well. (it's not just a vegan thing). Dairy, from what I recall, is the most reliable "common" source of B-12. But, obviously this won't work if you are vegan (whether your veganism is for medical or ethical reasons). So, please don't think I am trying to recommend you take dairy if you are vegan. Meat actually isn't as good of a source (aborbtion problems I believe).
A really good "uncommon" source is feces. It's true that we make B-12 in our intestines- but "most" people do not make it soon enough in the intestine to be able to absorb it. Thus the eating of feces in our animal cousins has a real health benefit. There is some discussion on the internet that people believe that if you eat raw your intestine will adjust and make the B-12 further up in the intestine. But, I don't believe there is much good evidence of that.
Here's a vegan article talking about it. I had some really good sources at one time (because I was concerned about B-12 myself). I may search around in my files and try to find more of them. But, this article may be a good start if you are interested:
I personally go for the liquid drops, even though I do eat some dairy (have been experimenting with cutting the dairy out). Since B-12 deficiencies are so common (in meat eaters too!) it was the one thing I was more concerned about the deficiency than "being natural." My mother has had problems with B-12 and she eats dairy and meat.
It is, of course up to you. Some people "take the chance" and assume that their intestine will make the B-12 where they can absorb it. Some people do actually eat their own feces to get the vitamin. It's up to you. But, I would seriously look into it before you choose to NOT supplement IF your vegan (raw or cooked). Just so that you can make that decision knowing all the facts.
sister becky, i do agree with some of the things you said. however, much of the research has been influenced by the meat and dairy industry, they have a lot of money, a lot of power, and a total disregard for the population's health. if you're healthy, anything you don't get from fruits, veggies, and the sun, your body will synthesize on it's own.
if you get tested for it, doctors will tell you that you are deficient, because they are taught to use rda levels for vitamins and minerals. rda levels are set for the standard american diet. anyone eating animal products or cooked foods will need a lot more of every vitamin and mineral because the vitamins and minerals from their sad diets are deranged and not as readily available as vitamins and minerals coming from raw fruits and veggies. also, animal products like dairy affect your absorption of vitamins and minerals.